ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by El Fuego » 25 Oct 2007 11:15

Any way of linking into Dedimania records?

Or plans to implement a separate public database of records?
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by Xymph » 25 Oct 2007 12:00

soehest wrote:A small request is also in place :-)
A thing which would show who has the most #1 records on the tracks being played.
That would have been pretty easy to add, but then I got an even better idea. In major sporting events like the Olympics and World Championships Atletics, medal tables are compiled with the countries that have the most gold, silver and bronze medals, like this. The same can be done with #1, #2 and #3 records on all tracks, like a top-100 list of /summary results. This /topsums command is now done and will be in v0.85. 8)
El Fuego wrote:Any way of linking into Dedimania records?
Or plans to implement a separate public database of records?
I'm going to look into that after v0.85.

Meanwhile, any other requests/fixes?
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by cow » 25 Oct 2007 19:13

sorry have to disagree on the elitist attitude remark
been on my server for ages and it is just plainly easier to see when your racing and dont have to look down.
plus the records themselves make for a so called elitist attidtude, or dont you see the number 1 rec.
I dont mind you dont want to impliment it as it is very easy
but i have never ever seen anyone cheered for 45 even in the most tight record tracks.
and they can annouce it if extra proud. SOrry i like the lack of spam better(which is why i meantioned the chat log, my place gets to busy to chat with the server always going off) and if you think it causes elitism, you just dont know my clan as we are the most laid back accepting and friendly and helpful individual you will meet on tmn. Are you just against all my ideas? as your responses seem a bit.. i dont know far reaching. Just say you dont like the idea.. i for one know about 35 people that do liek the idea. a but your topsum idea seems just as "elitists" forming as mine.. and you even use a simular example about the oylpics which i was goign to use in mine, but gold silver and bronze a bit harder to describe in color codes than blue, red, white.

But i guess you could show people on these tight reocrd tracks if there is any room for them to atcually get a record. akak the differntce between first and last. and how many tie for first. But normally when tracks get ooo tight,, i just use admin removethis.. with 400+ tracks.. i can do it all day without reducing my track numbers much.. and admin removethis works in windows.. admin deletethis does not.

I am anti elitist on my server, we even refused to allow a unusually great player, not join our clan, simply do to his elitist attitude.

as for suggestions.. sicne you seem to like to change all the terms that we have grown used to over time, you think you could make your plugin backwards commpaitible for those of us that already had a pimped up aseco... it is a pain to go through and make sure that /replay and /restart work and that /pm and /msg
cause really the entire server gets upset when i replace my aseco with yours untill i go through and "fix it"
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by El Fuego » 25 Oct 2007 21:02

Code: Select all

$chatvote['votes'] = floor($numplrs * $vote_ratios[0]);
I recommend that is changed to ...

Code: Select all

$chatvote['votes'] = ceil($numplrs * $vote_ratios[0]);
(where [0] may be [1], [2] etc.)

If there are a small number of players then using floor() means a very small number of votes, even if the ratio is set high. e.g. ratio = 0.7 and players = 2. Result is 1.4 thus floor() gives 1 whereas ceil() gives 2. This would stop automatic votes always succeeding. :)
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by Xymph » 25 Oct 2007 21:36

El Fuego wrote:

Code: Select all

$chatvote['votes'] = floor($numplrs * $vote_ratios[0]);
I recommend that is changed to ...

Code: Select all

$chatvote['votes'] = ceil($numplrs * $vote_ratios[0]);
(where [0] may be [1], [2] etc.)

If there are a small number of players then using floor() means a very small number of votes, even if the ratio is set high. e.g. ratio = 0.7 and players = 2. Result is 1.4 thus floor() gives 1 whereas ceil() gives 2. This would stop automatic votes always succeeding. :)
Hmm, I see what you mean, but using ceil() also has downsides in that votes with more players become harder to pass. E.g. ratio 0.7 and 6 players (4.2) would require 5 to agree instead of 4, and with 9 players (6.3) would require 7 instead of 6. Is that really a good approach?
How about just making an exception for low player numbers: if 2 or 3 players then the minimum becomes 2 votes, and with 4 or more floor() does its usual cut-off job?

Xymph
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by blooper » 25 Oct 2007 21:53

I just upgraded and it works great, but I have a few questions and suggestions.


1. How can I remove the line with the arrow? It seems redundant, since the top 8 records are also visible. Maybe you could make a change in v0.85 that automatically disables that line when the top 8 are displayed before the round.
Image


2. How can I disable this line? In v0.85, instead of putting this line in the chat, (if it's possible) why don't you put it in the callvote window that pops up? If not, you should put another true/false in the options to disable the line completely.
Image


3. Mabye this isn't the best place to ask, but how can I add other colors to the full Jfreu plugin? There's only red, yellow, green, blue, and white. I would like to add orange ($f80) to the login message.
Image


As always, thanks for the great work, Xymph! :pil

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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by Xymph » 25 Oct 2007 22:21

cow wrote:sorry have to disagree on the elitist attitude remark
Well, maybe that was a bit strongly worded, sorry if it ticked you off.
cow wrote:been on my server for ages and it is just plainly easier to see when your racing and dont have to look down.
plus the records themselves make for a so called elitist attidtude, or dont you see the number 1 rec.
I dont mind you dont want to impliment it as it is very easy
but i have never ever seen anyone cheered for 45 even in the most tight record tracks.
I have seen it plenty of times on my server, even with rec 60 or worse (I run with $maxrecs=100). But, different servers for different audiences I guess. :)
cow wrote:and they can annouce it if extra proud. SOrry i like the lack of spam better(which is why i meantioned the chat log, my place gets to busy to chat with the server always going off) and if you think it causes elitism, you just dont know my clan as we are the most laid back accepting and friendly and helpful individual you will meet on tmn. Are you just against all my ideas?
Hold on, all? Why that exaggeration? While in principle I think I don't have to honor every request from everyone, how many of yours have I ignored in practice (or from others, for that matter)?
You wanted chat-based voting, I built it; you asked for /chatlog, it's in there; you pointed out /chatlog problems, I fixed them; you need /admin removethis & erasethis, see below. The only request I found in your posting history that I didn't include is the jukebox credits, but then you have a lot of additional plugins on your server so it apparently has a lot of specialized needs. My goal in maintaining the official distribution is to have it apply to the majority of servers, without extra overhead, and also to leave the responsibility of those specialized plugins with their original authors. This project is already taking up all my spare time as it is. :lol:

Where is your server anyway? Can I take a look to see what's going on and better understand your position?
cow wrote:as your responses seem a bit.. i dont know far reaching. Just say you dont like the idea.. i for one know about 35 people that do liek the idea. a but your topsum idea seems just as "elitists" forming as mine.. and you even use a simular example about the oylpics which i was goign to use in mine, but gold silver and bronze a bit harder to describe in color codes than blue, red, white.
Yeah, so I'll tell you what, I'll meet you halfway: I added a <limit> field to localdatabase.xml and if it's lower than $maxrecs, records above the limit will not be displayed. This will be in v0.85, and you can set it to 5 or 10 or whatever you like. But all the colors remain the same because blue, yellow, red, orange, etc are already in use for other types of messages and I feel it would be confusing to change record messages to use the same ones.
cow wrote:But i guess you could show people on these tight reocrd tracks if there is any room for them to atcually get a record. akak the differntce between first and last. and how many tie for first. But normally when tracks get ooo tight,, i just use admin removethis.. with 400+ tracks.. i can do it all day without reducing my track numbers much.. and admin removethis works in windows.. admin deletethis does not.
Right, so I built them and they'll be in v0.85 too. Happy now? :P
cow wrote:I am anti elitist on my server, we even refused to allow a unusually great player, not join our clan, simply do to his elitist attitude.
Okay, it really ticked you off. That wasn't my intention.
cow wrote:as for suggestions.. sicne you seem to like to change all the terms that we have grown used to over time, you think you could make your plugin backwards commpaitible for those of us that already had a pimped up aseco... it is a pain to go through and make sure that /replay and /restart work and that /pm and /msg
cause really the entire server gets upset when i replace my aseco with yours untill i go through and "fix it"
Once again, all? You have to be more careful with those generalizations, cause they're really not true. :roll:
I changed /msg into /pm because it better describes that it's a private message, corresponds with /admin pm and /pma, and is one letter less to type. :) I used /replay instead of /restart (in slly's mod) because the latter is simply named wrong, it is not restarting the track immediately, but queuing it for replay after completion, exactly what my /replay does too. And /replay is consistent with the existing /admin replay command that was already in v0.80, for the same reason. Is it so hard for your users to get used to two renamed commands? I promise I won't do it again. :P

Xymph
Last edited by Xymph on 25 Oct 2007 22:50, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by Xymph » 25 Oct 2007 22:45

blooper wrote:1. How can I remove the line with the arrow? It seems redundant, since the top 8 records are also visible. Maybe you could make a change in v0.85 that automatically disables that line when the top 8 are displayed before the round.
Yeah, that does seem a bit redundant... okay, I changed it so you'll see either the original single record or the top-8 list, depending on the config flag.
blooper wrote:2. How can I disable this line? In v0.85, instead of putting this line in the chat, (if it's possible) why don't you put it in the callvote window that pops up? If not, you should put another true/false in the options to disable the line completely.
No, it cannot be put in the callvote popup. In the init_votes() function if you set $global_explain = false, a player only sees the message once upon joining (if [s]he even notices it among all the messages), and nobody else sees it when other players connect. Isn't that ok? I thought some 'advertising' would be useful to make as many players as possible familiar with the system, if it's in use on a server.
blooper wrote:3. Mabye this isn't the best place to ask, but how can I add other colors to the full Jfreu plugin? There's only red, yellow, green, blue, and white. I would like to add orange ($f80) to the login message.
In jfreu.plugin.php at line 183 you'll find the color definitions, where you can add:

Code: Select all

  $ora=$aseco->server->jfreu->orange=$aseco->formatColors('$z$s{#emotic}');
Edit, forgot to mention: And in function player_connect at line 963 repeat the local variable assignment:

Code: Select all

  $ora=$aseco->server->jfreu->orange;
Now you can use $ora in the login message around line 991.
blooper wrote:As always, thanks for the great work, Xymph! :pil
You're welcome.
Last edited by Xymph on 26 Oct 2007 00:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by soehest » 25 Oct 2007 23:50

Xymph wrote:
El Fuego wrote:

Code: Select all

$chatvote['votes'] = floor($numplrs * $vote_ratios[0]);
I recommend that is changed to ...

Code: Select all

$chatvote['votes'] = ceil($numplrs * $vote_ratios[0]);
(where [0] may be [1], [2] etc.)

Hmm, I see what you mean, but using ceil() also has downsides in that votes with more players become harder to pass. E.g. ratio 0.7 and 6 players (4.2) would require 5 to agree instead of 4, and with 9 players (6.3) would require 7 instead of 6. Is that really a good approach?
How about just making an exception for low player numbers: if 2 or 3 players then the minimum becomes 2 votes, and with 4 or more floor() does its usual cut-off job?

Xymph
I would like to see the exception approach as votes using a different system than the normal callvote has hard time passing already :-) People has to get used to it which is fair, and it is actually doing a nice job i think :-)

Daniel

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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by soehest » 26 Oct 2007 00:09

Xymph wrote:
blooper wrote:1. How can I remove the line with the arrow? It seems
Yeah, that does seem a bit redundant... okay, I changed it so you'll see either the original single record or the top-8 list, depending on the config flag.
Great, was about to report the same thing as i too think it was redundant, the new top list looks so great, especially because you can see the entire range 1 to the last 50 which is very nice :-)
Xymph wrote:
blooper wrote:]2. How can I disable this line? In v0.85, instead of putting this line in the chat,
No, it cannot be put in the callvote popup. In the init_votes() function if you set $global_explain = false, a player only sees the message once upon joining (if [s]he even notices it among all the messages), and nobody else sees it when other players connect. Isn't that ok? I thought some 'advertising' would be useful to make as many players as possible familiar with the system, if it's in use on a server.
An option to disable this line which is shown to the player only would be good i think, people never tends to read those lines when they join anyway, it is better to have it in the hint system which is displayed after each track, people has to look on those :D

Regards
Daniel (waiting around for 0.85 and trying to learn the quote tags) :1010

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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by El Fuego » 26 Oct 2007 08:18

callvotes -> The issue I was really driving at was that with only a couple of players on the server a single player could monopolise the replay/skip etc. votes, in that their /y would ALWAYS make the vote succeed.

The alternative solution you suggest sounds good. Which leads me to ...

Supplementary suggestion ... move the $chatvote['votes'] = floor($numplrs * $vote_ratios[0]); (and similar) calls to a separate function (e.g. $chatvote['votes'] = getReqdVotes ($numplrs, $voteratios[0]);) so that tweaks to vote numbers can be easily made in a single place (the getReqdVotes() function) rather then in 4 different places in the plugin. :)
Cheers!
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by Xymph » 26 Oct 2007 10:59

El Fuego wrote:callvotes -> The issue I was really driving at was that with only a couple of players on the server a single player could monopolise the replay/skip etc. votes, in that their /y would ALWAYS make the vote succeed.
Yes, I understood that the first time. :P :lol:
El Fuego wrote:The alternative solution you suggest sounds good. Which leads me to ...

Supplementary suggestion ... move the $chatvote['votes'] = floor($numplrs * $vote_ratios[0]); (and similar) calls to a separate function (e.g. $chatvote['votes'] = getReqdVotes ($numplrs, $voteratios[0]);) so that tweaks to vote numbers can be easily made in a single place (the getReqdVotes() function) rather then in 4 different places in the plugin. :)
Right, now that the decision logic becomes a bit more involved, that makes sense. It would eventually have come to me, but thanks for leading the way. :)

After mapping out all the fractional vote counts for 2-9 players versus ratios of 0.4, 0.5, 0.6 & 0.7, I found that using round() instead of floor() does the "right thing" in most cases up to 7 players. E.g. 3 players and ratios >= 0.5 will result in 2 votes required, 4 players with 0.7 requires 3 votes but 2 otherwise, but also 6 players and 0.6 requires 4, 7 players with 0.4 requires 3, etc. etc. With 8 or more players, round() isn't really needed anymore. Only for 2 & 3 players an extra adjustment is needed:

Code: Select all

// determine required number of votes
function required_votes($aseco, $ratio) {

  $numplrs = active_players($aseco);

  // compute normal vote count
  if ($numplrs <= 7) {
    $votes = round($numplrs * $ratio, 0);
  } else {
    $votes = floor($numplrs * $ratio);
  }
  // exceptions for low player count
  if ($votes == 0) {
    $votes = 1; // needed for /y
  } elseif ($numplrs >= 2 && $numplrs <= 3 && $votes == 1) {
    $votes = 2; // minimum
  }

  return $votes;
}
How does that look to you? The one downside I can think of is requiring 2 votes for a kick vote with 2 players, which can't be passed if the object of the kick doesn't cooperate. :wink: But any voting with just 2 participants is a statistically icky situation anyway. :D

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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by El Fuego » 26 Oct 2007 12:32

That looks fine (although I've only glanced through it). Regarding kick votes - in reality, if there are only 2 players on the server then kick votes are pointless anyway. In many cases one of the players on-server is likely to be an admin (or a mini-mod if you use that plugin) so an annoying player could be kicked anyway. :)
Cheers!
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by Xymph » 26 Oct 2007 13:49

El Fuego wrote:That looks fine (although I've only glanced through it). Regarding kick votes - in reality, if there are only 2 players on the server then kick votes are pointless anyway. In many cases one of the players on-server is likely to be an admin (or a mini-mod if you use that plugin) so an annoying player could be kicked anyway. :)
Right, so this will be in the imminent v0.85 release then. I could release it later today, but I'd like to wait for a response from cow first.
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Re: ASECO/RASP v0.84 released!

Post by El Fuego » 26 Oct 2007 14:35

I've just modified the existing 0.84 rasp_votes plugin with that function - works sweet. 8)
Cheers!
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