Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by fng_thatoneguy » 19 Apr 2010 14:54

jamie_macdonald wrote:yeah seems to be the case, nice to see other angles though ...
...I have never had as bad an experience with DRM as you lot have had obviously ... I use steam for most of my games, i dont use the offline mode as well internet is less likely to be disconnected than the frindge empty of milk nowdays.... least where i live (london).

I think the DRM should have offline options for those withought a connection of course though .. .so i understand the struggle ...but i can understand also why the industry is grasping frantically to find a solution ..

..i have stated my opposition to no offline mode to nadeo and also the ubisoft , there is not much more a man can do really.

I just say cut some slack cause i can understand how fustrated these companies must be ... it's like having someone rob your house and then the police sticking up for the thieves and not you ... wholly unnaceptable morally!

But your 100% correct in saying that it's about time us paying users were also "cut some slack" but i wonder if the latter is a pheasable solution ... i mean logistically will lettign us have an easier time make less people steal their stuff? i somehow doubt it.

To sum up why i "seem" to disagree - i see lots of moaning .. at the wrong people ... and no solutions ... thats what i dont like :thumbsup:
Good points. :thumbsup:

It does feel, sometimes, in my own country (USA) that criminal rights are put above victim rights as well... that's a shame and not acceptable either.

And take heart... we gamers that are ticked off will still support those that don't make it such a pain in the butt to play games... I'm actually all but talked into Starcraft since I know single-player will at least not require always online. The problem I still have is if the connection drops during a LAN game, will everyone be dumped out or will it fail gracefully. The offline option is still a must in my opinion too; and that's what's keeping me from my final decision.

Let's hope Blizzard isn't as brutal as Ubi and EA have become, and hope that Ubi lightens up by the time TM2 is released.

Thanks for the good discussion Jamie and others...
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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by EntropicLqd » 19 Apr 2010 18:20

jamie_macdonald wrote:..i have stated my opposition to no offline mode to nadeo and also the ubisoft , there is not much more a man can do really...
The only thing that you can do is not buy the game. And not pirate it either.

There's nothing that annoys me more than seeing people post, "I'm not buying this game because of the DRM, I'll wait for the crack and download that instead.". All that does is send a very clear message to the publisher that states, "Your copy protection isn't good enough.". The only way to beat DRM is to not buy the game and not pirate it. And make sure that you email the publisher to tell them why you are boycotting their product.

And if you say you are going to boycott a game, then you'd better be prepared to do so (unlike the laughable MW2 boycott).

I own copies of all of the TrackMania games because, quite frankly, they are great fun. TM-2 will most likely be the first TM game I won't ever own or play.

I quote from May's UK PC Gamer review of the latest Splinter Cell (page 77)
...A day and a half have passed since I was last able to log into Splinter Cell: Conviction and play it. Ubisoft's new DRM system will not allow you to play this game of you're not connected to the Internet. If you connection drops out, even in singleplayer, the game pauses and waits for it to re-establish...
I point blank refuse to buy a game with such a copy protection scheme.

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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by fng_thatoneguy » 19 Apr 2010 19:20

EntropicLqd wrote:There's nothing that annoys me more than seeing people post, "I'm not buying this game because of the DRM, I'll wait for the crack and download that instead.". All that does is send a very clear message to the publisher that states, "Your copy protection isn't good enough.". The only way to beat DRM is to not buy the game and not pirate it. And make sure that you email the publisher to tell them why you are boycotting their product.

And if you say you are going to boycott a game, then you'd better be prepared to do so (unlike the laughable MW2 boycott).
My sentiments exactly. If everyone doesn't buy the game, but then goes and pirates it, we've created this scenario:

Pirates are bad people because they stole and started this whole mess.
Companies counter with DRM protection schemes that annoy... and keep making them worse until the experience for the paying customer is so bad, they've lowered themselves to as loatheful a state as the pirates.
Customers boycott, and in turn go pirate the game... thus bringing everyone down to the loatheful state of the pirates...

Then for sure everyone has lost.

EntropicLqd is exactly right... the way to win is to put your money where your mouths/keyboards are... don't just come whine in forums, stop buying the games that implement this stuff, and make sure the game producers/publishers know why you're not buying the game.

Don't just come rant on the forums, then still go out and buy the game because you lack enough self-control to hold off til the message can be put across effectively.

I, for one, as I've mentioned plenty before have been boycotting Ubisoft games since their decision to not release Prince of Persia Epilogue to PC; and since the Online Services Platform announcement have been given all the more reason to continue. I'll ease mine as soon as they mellow this DRM madness back down, especially for single-player games, for heaven's sake... but for now, I'm putting my money where my mouth is; and will continue to do so for any company that gets this bad with their DRM.

Glad to know someone else will be doing the same, EntropicLqd. :3
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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by Trackmaniack » 20 Apr 2010 13:28

Look, I'm pretty sure not everyone in here is just bitching about how they'll crack the game just to get back at the DRM people. I for one won't. Sure, if a year, two years, goes by and there's NO sign of ANYTHING being done--then I'll think about pirating it. But I at least want to give people a chance to redeem themselves...let 'em fix their mistake. BTW, just FYI, all this talk, so far, is speculative. I'm pretty sure with all the complaining being done on the forums so far, Nadeo and Florent are going to see we DO NOT want this in TM2, and will make sure it doesn't get into our beloved trackmania.
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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by jamie_macdonald » 21 Apr 2010 09:53

EntropicLqd wrote:The only way to beat DRM is to not buy the game and not pirate it. And make sure that you email the publisher to tell them why you are boycotting their product
yes this may be what you would like to do ... i AM getting this game regardelss of DRM issue's, i have stated my opposition to "intrusive DRM" but also stated my support for "non intrusive" forms.

I want the game regardless and i will get it .. simplez :thumbsup:

Am not boycotting TM for anyone or thing :wink:

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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by fng_thatoneguy » 21 Apr 2010 13:50

jamie_macdonald wrote:
EntropicLqd wrote:The only way to beat DRM is to not buy the game and not pirate it. And make sure that you email the publisher to tell them why you are boycotting their product
yes this may be what you would like to do ... i AM getting this game regardelss of DRM issue's, i have stated my opposition to "intrusive DRM" but also stated my support for "non intrusive" forms.

I want the game regardless and i will get it .. simplez :thumbsup:

Am not boycotting TM for anyone or thing :wink:
Let's be very clear... none of us have said we're hard-set going to boycott TM. We said we would not purchase it IF it's subjected to the same crap the rest of the Ubi games are shipping with now. We're still holding out hope that it won't be there, or at least toned down to tolerable by the time TM2 is released.

We all want the game equally bad, and we all want to support Nadeo, who have brought such goodness over the years. I've already stated before, I wouldn't mind sending them directly the full price of TM2 should I decided not to purchase it because of invasive/crippling DRM, to tell Nadeo I still want to support their gaming goodness, but piss off the publisher and let them know I won't put up with their mandated DRM crap.

Remember, we're not just whining, we like the producers of the games are trying to find solutions to a problem. I'd still love to see a company go back, make a major game that everyone is anticipating straight for PC only (like Nadeo is doing), and later do a console port, or ensure the PC release before the consoles) and keep it DRM-free, market the crap out of it before release, completely emphasizing the point that it's DRM-free, then ensure the release before the consoles (if a console port is also made); and see what the sales are like. We all know it would still be pirated, but would the sales still make them a killing... and would those numbers, with the projected numbers of how much it would have taken to implement, support, remove a nasty DRM taken into account show a better bottom line for the company than with DRM included? Too bad there are too many variables in that mix that keep the companies from feeling like it's a valid experiment.

Ubi was actually almost there with Prince of Persia 2008, but they failed to adequately market the thing and get the word out that it was DRM-free (I actually tripped on the knowledge in their forums) and worse yet, it was released after the console release, so all the die-hard fans had already bought it there. Since it was a console port, there was no compelling reason to get it on the PC if you already had the console version... and even more reason not to after they announced they wouldn't be releasing the Epilogue content addition for the PC.

Anyway, I hope we all get to play TM2 because we'll have no DRM, or an "acceptable-to-swallow" DRM for TM2. I just keep hoping that with all the games that have been released on the Ubi online services platform that have had so many people not able to play their game consistent, that it will get to a point where enough is enough and they'll start removing the "always online" restriction.

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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by otmb;ripbox » 21 Apr 2010 19:22

with me all i want is for it to be playable off line and not have to connect to some stupid Ubisoft server just to play and/or activate solo mode!!!

Im crying about this because im out of a job at the moment, due to move into independent accommodation and unsure if ill be able to afford to rent the internet..... i will save any spare coins i can to buy the game but only dependent on if i can buy it take it home and install and play without the hassle of needing to connect to the net every time i wish to play or even a one time online activation, it just wont be feasible to do such a thing..... ok i could get a wireless dongle but im not gonna pay to play.... if i wanted to pay to play id play World Of Warcraft
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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by TStarGermany » 23 Apr 2010 02:52

well since the evening of april 21st, the DRM topic has become obsolete and probably won't bother us again in the near future :gobananas:
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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by jamie_macdonald » 23 Apr 2010 10:46

TStarGermany wrote:well since the evening of april 21st, the DRM topic has become obsolete and probably won't bother us again in the near future :gobananas:
:D :thumbsup:

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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by EntropicLqd » 23 Apr 2010 12:00

TStarGermany wrote:well since the evening of april 21st, the DRM topic has become obsolete and probably won't bother us again in the near future :gobananas:
Why? Link please.

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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by TStarGermany » 23 Apr 2010 12:21

well LOL, for that particular link i'd get kicked off the forum.. rightfully so :wink: let's just say: the DRM system has finally been killed.
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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by w1lla » 23 Apr 2010 13:37

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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by Xymph » 23 Apr 2010 14:29

EntropicLqd wrote:
TStarGermany wrote:well since the evening of april 21st, the DRM topic has become obsolete and probably won't bother us again in the near future
Why? Link please.
A link to the first page of a 185-page thread isn't very useful, w1lla. :roll:

As for the why, just check major gaming news sites such as Blue's News.
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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by EntropicLqd » 25 Apr 2010 19:12

TStarGermany wrote:well LOL, for that particular link i'd get kicked off the forum.. rightfully so :wink: let's just say: the DRM system has finally been killed.
I presume youare talking about the fact that the Ubisoft DRM has been cracked (at least in part). Having DRM that's been cracked doesn't mean that the DRM is no longer a problem. Sure it may mean that the game is more convenient to play; but it also means that you need to download a crack (or other 3rd party program) which could contain anything (trojan or virus) or nothing.

If you have the crack; are you going to pirate the game? If you do Ubisoft has every reason to continue its insane anyi-piracy measures; and will continue to make them ever more intrusive. If you buy the game then you are sending Ubisoft a message that their DRM is acceptable to you as a paying customer. And I bet having the crack will break a lot of the community features that make TM-United so cool.

The only way to show Ubisoft that they have gone too far is to boycott the game and also refuse to pirate it; and to ensure that Ubisoft know why their sales figures are completely broken.

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Re: Ubisoft online services platform - WTF?

Post by Beta64 » 27 Apr 2010 16:19

Considering Ubisoft's failure to announce the abandonment of the DRM and RUSE's delay to November suggests to me that Ubisoft is retooling their DRM. The problem won't be solved by cracks either.

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