FREEZONE

General Discussion about Trackmania Nations ESWC.

Moderator: TM-Patrol

eyebo
cyclist
cyclist
Posts: 32
Joined: 08 Jan 2010 10:38
Owned TM-games: TMU, TMS, TMO

Re: FREEZONE

Post by eyebo » 11 Dec 2010 03:10

I haven't posted to this thread yet (except to clear up a misconception regarding the FreeZone servers), so I feel I must relate my opinion. Well, I already did on the TMX TMNF forum, so I'll just quote my post from there.
eyebo wrote:For those suggesting a return to TMN ESWC, perhaps you should get your copy of Stunts out again. Get back to the basics. :3

In regards to the rest. You either support Nadeo's efforts to keep the game alive, or you don't.

Even if you can't support them monetarily by buying TMUF, you can still support their decision to try to keep the game alive by being positive about it in the forums.

In the short term a lot of people will be affected and hurt by the changes... but that's in the short term. Mostly those affected are those who are active in leagues and other competitions that need to change servers or get on relays to watch matches. It's a hassle to use the 3 favorites and constantly change them. Server participation will drop as a result, and some servers may even disappear as a result. That's all in the short term. These are knee-jerk reactions to a shift in how you interact with the game.

In the long term I'm confident this will be a good thing for both the community (and I mean the entire community, not just the tmnf community) and it will enable Nadeo to keep hosting the game by shifting more features towards the pay version of the game and encouraging people to buy it. I'm sure a lot of people won't buy it, but many others will.

What Nadeo could do is better communicate these features and make it clearer that TMUF is the premium version of TMNF. That's not entirely clear because of the difference in names.

One other thought I'd like to express. As I'm sure many realize, the very vocal part of the community doesn't represent the numerous casual players who download the game and don't mind spending a little money to get some extra features. These are the users that Nadeo needs in order to make ends meet, to keep tmnf/tmuf up, and to keep development alive for future games.

As Bucky stated, the majority of TMNF is still free. The editor is still free. Unlimited blocks, unlimited replays, unlimited tracks. You still get an incredible amount of features free.

It amazes me how much people spend on WoW and other games on a monthly basis. Nadeo is only asking a one time fee to get the extra features of the game. It's so minimal compared to the return in hours of fun you gain. It's comparable to paying pennies for some other game that gives much less enjoyment.

True, many will be left behind, namely those unwilling to fork over a few dollars to keep the game alive. Sadly the others left behind are those unable to because of their situation in life (no credit/debit card or parental restrictions on online purchases). They can still build tracks though, and play offline tracks or play on LAN or use the favorites system to play on their favorite servers. I suggest everyone add PPO NF to their favorites. Make it a meeting place of TMX peoples. A place where you can all still meet online.

In conclusion I must say.... "Time marches on, things change". Those who don't change with it are destined to be left behind. Such is life.

Don't let this slight shift in the game cause you to react in some way you will regret in years to come. You are the community. TM is what you make it. This has always been the truth. Nadeo gives us the tools, we create the game. This hasn't changed. If you leave or ragequit, then the downfall of the community will be brought about, not by Nadeo, but by your own inability to adapt to the changing tides.

User avatar
[RW]
pedestrian
pedestrian
Posts: 8
Joined: 10 Dec 2010 12:21
Owned TM-games: TMNF

Re: FREEZONE

Post by [RW] » 11 Dec 2010 03:13

Yeah, after buying TMUF, in a few months, NADEO forces us to buy TM2
[RW]

eyebo
cyclist
cyclist
Posts: 32
Joined: 08 Jan 2010 10:38
Owned TM-games: TMU, TMS, TMO

Re: FREEZONE

Post by eyebo » 11 Dec 2010 03:15

No one is forcing you to buy anything [RW].

Gekko
speedy pilot
speedy pilot
Posts: 550
Joined: 03 Sep 2006 18:20
Owned TM-games: ALL
Location: Naples - Italy
Contact:

Re: FREEZONE

Post by Gekko » 11 Dec 2010 03:19

You know now what i do?????
I go on Atlantica Online, go on the ITEM MALL and spend 10€ to get some extra things!!!!!!
ITEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEMMMMMM MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!!!!
In 2011 you can't code a game without, where players of all the world can spend how much they want from 1$ to 100000000000$..........
Nadeo and Ubisoft WAKEEEE UPPP, don't wait Microsoft.
Pirate of the sillicon valley: "The enemy is not IBM, the enemy is Microsoft"!!!! Ahuahuhua!!!!

Try to do money by selling games!!!!! :grmblz:
(sorry if i seem rude, but i will continue until Nadeo FIRE who manage the marketing and the coders decided for DLM in TM2)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :grmblz:

eyebo
cyclist
cyclist
Posts: 32
Joined: 08 Jan 2010 10:38
Owned TM-games: TMU, TMS, TMO

Re: FREEZONE

Post by eyebo » 11 Dec 2010 04:53

By the way, I read the entire thread before making my post. A lot of very valid points made by a lot of people. Hopefully Nadeo is able to overlook the hateful attitudes of some players and see that most people react in such an emotional way because of how much they've come to love the game over the years... and don't want to see it ruined.

I have faith it'll all work out in the end.

Best wishes to the team. We'll get thru this together. :lovetm

User avatar
[RW]
pedestrian
pedestrian
Posts: 8
Joined: 10 Dec 2010 12:21
Owned TM-games: TMNF

Re: FREEZONE

Post by [RW] » 11 Dec 2010 07:20

Yeah, they made the perfect recipe of success (TM) and i hope they find a good solution for this problem.

BTW:eyebo, i was a little bit :grmblz: when i posted that 'nadeo-forcing' message
[RW]

Mort
smooth traffic navigator
smooth traffic navigator
Posts: 275
Joined: 16 Jan 2009 10:57
Owned TM-games: TMUF, TMNF
Location: Australia
Contact:

Re: FREEZONE

Post by Mort » 11 Dec 2010 08:09

I've just notcied that there are NO FREEZONE SERVERS in Australia at all. So that would mean any players here have to connect over high-ping connections to European servers! I can't even count the number of times my daughter has been kicked from servers for "causing lag" due to the high ping!

The more I think about this new Freezone thing the more I realise that it just isn't going to work. Unless of course they intended to make this a partial move toward getting rid of the free game completely.

I would love to see statistics from the Nadeo login servers showing the change in number of people playing after this change,

User avatar
Terron
speedy pilot
speedy pilot
Posts: 445
Joined: 02 Jun 2007 15:00
Owned TM-games: all full+some betas
Location: Earth

Re: FREEZONE

Post by Terron » 11 Dec 2010 08:28

do you remember text FREE AND FOR ALL from trailer? now it isnt free cause you are limited to free zone servers.
I think that nadeo should make possibility to buy coppers for real money (paypal, SMS,...) like EA did with NFSW (players can purchase BOOST credits and spend them in game)

User avatar
Knutselmaaster
swift roadking
swift roadking
Posts: 692
Joined: 16 Feb 2007 01:40
Owned TM-games: TMO/TMN/TMNF/TMU
Manialink(s): intr
Location: Between DisneyLand and Paris
Contact:

Re: FREEZONE

Post by Knutselmaaster » 11 Dec 2010 08:30

w1lla wrote:
Knutselmaaster wrote:Why not making a semi payed TM.
Like "TMN-Full"
And sell that for a lower price (as it has no tmu environments) and make a possibility to buy it with coppers.
I will gladly spend my coppers to keep my team alive.
Make it cheaper for organisations too.
That way you help keeping important teams/people in the game/community, so that it will be attractive for other free players to buy the game, as they know there is an active community to join...
Nice alternative but coppers cant be the same as dollars or euros
Coppers are not the same indeed.
The reason for my idea is to save the community, and thus give people reason to buy (with money).

Another idea, why not taking the advertisements in your own hands, Nadeo?
I'm sure that if you call some big brands with the offer to have their name in TM will work!
And why doesn't ubisoft use the advertisement possibilities to advertise their other games?

User avatar
[RW]
pedestrian
pedestrian
Posts: 8
Joined: 10 Dec 2010 12:21
Owned TM-games: TMNF

Re: FREEZONE

Post by [RW] » 11 Dec 2010 08:34

Knutselmaaster wrote:Coppers are not the same indeed.
The reason for my idea is to save the community, and thus give people reason to buy (with money).

Another idea, why not taking the advertisements in your own hands, Nadeo?
I'm sure that if you call some big brands with the offer to have their name in TM will work!
And why doesn't ubisoft use the advertisement possibilities to advertise their other games?
Hmm... good point...
Last edited by [RW] on 11 Dec 2010 08:40, edited 1 time in total.
[RW]

Marty
pedestrian
pedestrian
Posts: 7
Joined: 10 Dec 2010 19:22
Owned TM-games: TMNF TMUF X2

Re: FREEZONE

Post by Marty » 11 Dec 2010 08:38

eyebo wrote:I haven't posted to this thread yet (except to clear up a misconception regarding the FreeZone servers), so I feel I must relate my opinion. Well, I already did on the TMX TMNF forum, so I'll just quote my post from there.
eyebo wrote:For those suggesting a return to TMN ESWC, perhaps you should get your copy of Stunts out again. Get back to the basics. :3

In regards to the rest. You either support Nadeo's efforts to keep the game alive, or you don't.

Even if you can't support them monetarily by buying TMUF, you can still support their decision to try to keep the game alive by being positive about it in the forums.

In the short term a lot of people will be affected and hurt by the changes... but that's in the short term. Mostly those affected are those who are active in leagues and other competitions that need to change servers or get on relays to watch matches. It's a hassle to use the 3 favorites and constantly change them. Server participation will drop as a result, and some servers may even disappear as a result. That's all in the short term. These are knee-jerk reactions to a shift in how you interact with the game.

In the long term I'm confident this will be a good thing for both the community (and I mean the entire community, not just the tmnf community) and it will enable Nadeo to keep hosting the game by shifting more features towards the pay version of the game and encouraging people to buy it. I'm sure a lot of people won't buy it, but many others will.

What Nadeo could do is better communicate these features and make it clearer that TMUF is the premium version of TMNF. That's not entirely clear because of the difference in names.

One other thought I'd like to express. As I'm sure many realize, the very vocal part of the community doesn't represent the numerous casual players who download the game and don't mind spending a little money to get some extra features. These are the users that Nadeo needs in order to make ends meet, to keep tmnf/tmuf up, and to keep development alive for future games.

As Bucky stated, the majority of TMNF is still free. The editor is still free. Unlimited blocks, unlimited replays, unlimited tracks. You still get an incredible amount of features free.

It amazes me how much people spend on WoW and other games on a monthly basis. Nadeo is only asking a one time fee to get the extra features of the game. It's so minimal compared to the return in hours of fun you gain. It's comparable to paying pennies for some other game that gives much less enjoyment.

True, many will be left behind, namely those unwilling to fork over a few dollars to keep the game alive. Sadly the others left behind are those unable to because of their situation in life (no credit/debit card or parental restrictions on online purchases). They can still build tracks though, and play offline tracks or play on LAN or use the favorites system to play on their favorite servers. I suggest everyone add PPO NF to their favorites. Make it a meeting place of TMX peoples. A place where you can all still meet online.

In conclusion I must say.... "Time marches on, things change". Those who don't change with it are destined to be left behind. Such is life.

Don't let this slight shift in the game cause you to react in some way you will regret in years to come. You are the community. TM is what you make it. This has always been the truth. Nadeo gives us the tools, we create the game. This hasn't changed. If you leave or ragequit, then the downfall of the community will be brought about, not by Nadeo, but by your own inability to adapt to the changing tides.

So basically what you are saying is thank you to the community for building Trackmania into what it is, servers, Tracks, plugins etc. But now you've done it we are going to screw you over and make you pay, then turn it round to being your fault if it all goes pear shaped for not supporting the incredibly bad change.
<TM> Marty <3
Trackmaniacs

weerwolf1
smooth traffic navigator
smooth traffic navigator
Posts: 236
Joined: 08 May 2008 09:25
Owned TM-games: All but original
Location: The Netherlands

Re: FREEZONE

Post by weerwolf1 » 11 Dec 2010 08:42

Mort wrote:I've just notcied that there are NO FREEZONE SERVERS in Australia at all. So that would mean any players here have to connect over high-ping connections to European servers!
You can bet your ass that hosting for ALL FreeZoneServers is located in france. Thats just ingame localization even i can do.
LYNX°°°° - Maniaplanet Gaming Community!
news | clan | community | & more
°°°°

User avatar
TheM
Pit Crew
Pit Crew
Posts: 286
Joined: 25 Feb 2009 16:43
Owned TM-games: TMU(F), TMN(F), TM2
Location: Brabant, Netherlands
Contact:

Re: FREEZONE

Post by TheM » 11 Dec 2010 08:43

Why don't just show the screen you see when you join such a FreeZone server in all servers?
Just by doing this, you won't get any more United accounts.

People see TrackMania 2 coming, and not willing to pay for a 3 year old game.

eyebo
cyclist
cyclist
Posts: 32
Joined: 08 Jan 2010 10:38
Owned TM-games: TMU, TMS, TMO

Re: FREEZONE

Post by eyebo » 11 Dec 2010 09:33

Marty wrote:So basically what you are saying is thank you to the community for building Trackmania into what it is, servers, Tracks, plugins etc. But now you've done it we are going to screw you over and make you pay, then turn it round to being your fault if it all goes pear shaped for not supporting the incredibly bad change.
No, I'm saying the community's reaction and response to this shows their true colors. If the hardcore free side of TM dies because they can't adapt to the inevitable changes in the economic system, then that's just life.

You can either keep playing TM (buy it if you prefer it without the restrictions), or go play something else. No one is forcing you to do anything.

But the lack of empathy for Nadeo's financial situation and the lack of understanding for Nadeo's focus to do what they had to in order to keep the game free while still encouraging people to upgrade... it's just appalling and saddening.

Nothing is free, ever. Stuff costs money. If you're not paying for it, then someone else is! It's either because of ad support, or because someone decided to fit the bill until they could figure out how to make money on it.

TMNF is Nadeo's little trial for TMUF.

I've always felt Nadeo's intention from day one with the release of the Forever versions of TMU and TMN was to get people hooked on TM with TMNF and then they would buy TMUF.

But apparently that's leveled off. Many TMNF players were satisfied with TMNF. Why? Because Nadeo made it too good! There wasn't huge incentive to upgrade to TMUF. But now there is, and maybe now people will actually feel the need to upgrade.

We all know TM2 is right around the corner, but surely the amount of enjoyment you've already had the last few years is enough to get you to invest in a future game. Call your purchase of TMUF a donation towards the development of TM2.

Think of it however you like. But if you're not being constructive, you're being the opposite, and it's not really helping anyone.

Some parts of TMNF may die off because a bunch of freeloaders can't stand the idea of paying for something. But that won't hurt Nadeo since those are users who wouldn't have bought TM2 anyway.

The people who actually care about Nadeo and TM will buy TMUF and invest in TM's future. Servers will stay up, United may even get a boost in playership online.

The other 6 environments aren't as bad as rumors would have you believe. They require just as much skill as stadium, and without them Nadeo would never have been able to afford to create the free game you all so desperately love, so some respect is in order.

At the end of the day, it's just a game, and if you take it so seriously that you're on the verge of having a panic attack over the whole thing, then you need to take a step back and examine your life and put things in perspective.

Money makes the world go round. If you don't understand this, go read a book.

Marty
pedestrian
pedestrian
Posts: 7
Joined: 10 Dec 2010 19:22
Owned TM-games: TMNF TMUF X2

Re: FREEZONE

Post by Marty » 11 Dec 2010 09:46

eyebo wrote:
Marty wrote:So basically what you are saying is thank you to the community for building Trackmania into what it is, servers, Tracks, plugins etc. But now you've done it we are going to screw you over and make you pay, then turn it round to being your fault if it all goes pear shaped for not supporting the incredibly bad change.
No, I'm saying the community's reaction and response to this shows their true colors. If the hardcore free side of TM dies because they can't adapt to the inevitable changes in the economic system, then that's just life.

You can either keep playing TM (buy it if you prefer it without the restrictions), or go play something else. No one is forcing you to do anything.

But the lack of empathy for Nadeo's financial situation and the lack of understanding for Nadeo's focus to do what they had to in order to keep the game free while still encouraging people to upgrade... it's just appalling and saddening.

Nothing is free, ever. Stuff costs money. If you're not paying for it, then someone else is! It's either because of ad support, or because someone decided to fit the bill until they could figure out how to make money on it.

TMNF is Nadeo's little trial for TMUF.

I've always felt Nadeo's intention from day one with the release of the Forever versions of TMU and TMN was to get people hooked on TM with TMNF and then they would buy TMUF.

But apparently that's leveled off. Many TMNF players were satisfied with TMNF. Why? Because Nadeo made it too good! There wasn't huge incentive to upgrade to TMUF. But now there is, and maybe now people will actually feel the need to upgrade.

We all know TM2 is right around the corner, but surely the amount of enjoyment you've already had the last few years is enough to get you to invest in a future game. Call your purchase of TMUF a donation towards the development of TM2.

Think of it however you like. But if you're not being constructive, you're being the opposite, and it's not really helping anyone.

Some parts of TMNF may die off because a bunch of freeloaders can't stand the idea of paying for something. But that won't hurt Nadeo since those are users who wouldn't have bought TM2 anyway.

The people who actually care about Nadeo and TM will buy TMUF and invest in TM's future. Servers will stay up, United may even get a boost in playership online.

The other 6 environments aren't as bad as rumors would have you believe. They require just as much skill as stadium, and without them Nadeo would never have been able to afford to create the free game you all so desperately love, so some respect is in order.

At the end of the day, it's just a game, and if you take it so seriously that you're on the verge of having a panic attack over the whole thing, then you need to take a step back and examine your life and put things in perspective.

Money makes the world go round. If you don't understand this, go read a book.
Last post on this as im going to spend most of the day playing TM
Just to make you aware, I fully support TM brought it twice pay to run a server and no doubt will buy TM2, but by reading your reply you dont do your self any favours in trying to build a community spirit.
<TM> Marty <3
Trackmaniacs

Post Reply