TRACKMANIA FOREVER

General discussion about all the Trackmania series.

Moderator: TM-Patrol

Post Reply
Zooz
TM-Patrol
TM-Patrol
Posts: 5326
Joined: 13 Aug 2005 08:58
Owned TM-games: TMO, TMS, TMNF, TMUF
Manialink(s): zooz
Location: The Netherlands

TRACKMANIA FOREVER

Post by Zooz » 23 Mar 2008 00:07

Well, since the old Forever thread disappeared in a tragic late-night moderating accident, have a new one :mrgreen:
Zooz wrote: I was linked to a post of some leaked pics in the thread, and it was the newest post, but it got linked in such a way that it only displayed one post, so I thought it was a new thread, and hit the delete thread button. Whoops :oops:
I should not try to moderate at 1 AM -_-
Well, sorry for that one, so have the original post of that thread to make up for it:
Florent wrote: Here I will present the next free releases of Nadeo. The goal is to make a robust TrackMania to give it a long life. This is why the operation is called Forever.

Here is the complete list. We worked hard, we like this update at Nadeo. So, remember that instead of making it again bigger, we have decided to make it much stronger.

TrackMania Nations Forever
a new TrackMania Nations in the latest stadium
TrackMania United Forever
a big program update to make it last long on your desktop, such as a nocd and strong anticheat measures.
United-Nations
players of both game will be able to play on Stadium servers
Solo
Stunt mode, new tracks, menu work
Multiplayer
Cup mode, peer to peer work, dedicated server work, server search
ManiaLink
Identified links, text entry, file upload, user comments, search
MediaTracker
Trigger conditions, draw triangles, ingame replays
Coppers
Map revenues from audience, web exchange
Ladder
Antiboost, unified ladder
Many technical stuff
Nations player fixed login and nickname to avoid abuses, OpenAL, fast exit game, parental lock, networked car sound engine, langage automatic installation, URL dependancies in header, stereoscopic shooter, sound fade in on poping cars, more info on report abuse, php in editor url, big security work, master server optimisation etc.

Reminder: little fixes can occurs during the beta. It is very important to warn Nadeo during this phase of different issues. Maybe we can solve them. Keep in mind that there is some stuff that are too hard to change and even if they appear small things.

Disclaimer: some stuff is not yet done and could be absent from the release.
In case you hadn't noticed, Forever is the next big Trackmania update, for both TMU and TMN, and it's coming in the next few weeks. And if you can't wait, there will probably be an open beta to test it before the release.
Here's what it looks like (Desert, anyway):
Image

TMX had two interesting interviews with Florent about TMF:
First: http://united.tm-exchange.com/main.aspx ... =auto#auto
Second: http://united.tm-exchange.com/main.aspx ... =auto#auto

Some other Florent posts from the thread of varying levels of interestingness:

Old post from january about the delays:
Florent wrote:Here is what happened about the beta of Forever.

It was supposed to start in November.. but due to some work taking more time than scheduled, we moved that to december. But, then, I was leaving for holiday at the end of the month. I had to decide to tell the team to ready the beta for my return or to make additionnal work, usually about big subject. I took the second option because I think that Forever need to be as strong as possible.

I am unhappy to make this delay. I always wish I could avoid to give a date, but I also understand that it is cool to have one. This time, my target is an alpha just before we move our offices, and a beta once we are installed and running well. So, with the alpha before, the beta will be difficult to have before the 7th of Febuary. We have strong interest to release the beta before the 15th, because we think the tests to be crucial. We have worked nearly a year on this update, so we need to look after the test carefully.

Once the beta start, we will open, week after week, to more players. We have made a system were we will add on our side, the TMU login on a list that will give access to Nations or United beta. I also want to find a solution were most of TMU players can use Nations or United Forever before its release. It would compensate for the delay, makes some additionnal tests before the release and maybe convince some Nations only players to get United, which is good for us.

I will do the usual stupid games, since I still believe that having additionnal testers, than the VIP, is interesting.
On using cars on the wrong environments:
Florent wrote: we have tried this mix since three years, but I doubt it would be the big fun for the community. If you only like one gameplay, I understand what you are saying, but it is not really interesting at the end of the day. One environment with different cars is okay, different environments with one car is okay, but different environment with different cars is too big. Coast has always received more attacks from beginners, but if you ask, a it is the favourite of a lot of players. We can not divide the players by 49 choices.

As for the fact that players will have the new stadium for free, it is true. And I think it will be good to invite friends. It will also be good for people that like to play in this environment, because more players will create great tracks for it. Now, if you are jalous, it is sad.
This post had lots of Google Translation of Florent posts on the French forum:
Zooz wrote: Wow, Florent has been posting a lot on the French forum ^^
Let's throw some stuff through Google Translate...

Hylis wrote:
as from the moment when one left shot + right, there exist various viewers to read the vidéos kind. In fact, which is reloud, it is that in 3D time real Ca goes thanks to the pilots well, but to leave the vidéos it is delicate. Blow, one made an exit shot stereoscopy. In lle mediatracker, one posts the two images in blending, Ca allows nothing to see, but when one is accustomed, one guesses the result.

After one needs a stereoscopic viewer nevertheless vidéos.

if I am in form, I will spin you an example :mrgreen:
This one is about the stereoscopic shooter. I don't really get what he says, bad translator :P

This one seems to be about the origins of the patch:
Hylis wrote:
work was too much large on this update. All was touched. The objective was that nothing changes too much in order to prevent breaking the trick, but it is precisely for that that all will be to test and that beta will last also a long time.

after the appearance of cheating one wanted to make small a patch, and then while passing I asked so that the p2p walk better… but so that it turn really nickel was necessary to make a large master key above (now, it is signal ^_^) but that took as well time, as one established the link with the evolution virtualskipper. but that broke the menus and the mediatracker, of the blow one took again the circuits with the crusard to remake them to walk, but one made a cleaning of the components of scene etc At the end, this update took an insane time (it is the curse of forever) for a less visible result for the players. But I think that they would be dangerous to make the race with features and with dated, without paying attention to the maintenance of the code and pérénitté of our plays. There is too much thing which one likes in the past not to give him a future. And the Forever version were thought accordingly. One does not oblige the players to play there for always, there but one wants to allow them to be able to return for always.

More thoughts on the patch, probably in reply to something:
Hylis wrote:
the union of tmn and tmu is for me most important. at the beginning the project was called nations-united, and I hold to with it particularly for regionalization. For the community here presents, that which was connait a little, that can have less smell, but for the players who arrive, or those of the other countries, in other languages, I find that it is a good manners to exchange with other players. Until the day when one will have meeting organized between the zones. Forever it is so that its continuity makes its “history” For the eSport it is a little the same thing. The ESWC is on CS 1.6 and the taken again WCG one CS 1.6 this year, whereas last year it was source. I think that the update of TMN can help it to continue. By hoping well on the players of TMN of it are satisfied. In any case, one will have spent time there.

And for United, most important, it is to have constructive players, and players, as I saw some much here.

From an economic point of view, we will try to sell of United and to make publicity to maintain all that. Between the sales on line where the plays remain on the rays and the publicity which remunerates the lifespan, we can finally think more freely on the interest in the duration and less of launching. I specify that we do not seek to make players who play for always, but that they can return when they want. On this subject, for publicity, it is better several players during a few hours per week, rather than a player who does many hours. It is not yet profitable, but with the sales of United, Ca is supplemented well.

Lastly, for the blocks or enviros, we have limited means. It is a “rule” with Nadeo to be a group which functions together, and if one were to be too numerous, one would give in the quantity… if it is for that, to as much look at the number of plays which leave every week. In short, it is thought that to continue, it is necessary to rather make exeptionnelles things than in quantity. We began two enviros that we want to give free with Forever, but with the techno, the construction of blocks is long and these enviros would have been limited well too much compared to the others… and probably given up by the players; in any case, enough not balanced with our taste. One wants to make a balanced play of it.

Blow, to say to you, the graphic resources of Nadeo have been partly occupied for more than six months making an evolution in graphics. Forever is thus a walk before one to mitigate, but we wanted that it is broadest, open and solid possible.

voualà
Florent


PS: I find that it is damage to see a community criticizing another community. It is besides this spirit which we seek to make one can evolve/move with nations united. The play, there is nothing like it to link an international community in my opinion.
Seems there were plans for 2 more envs, but they put that on hold because they only want to make quality envs and didn't have the time/resources for that, or something.

About the status of these 2 envs, and an indirect reply to the TMN players who feel ripped off:
Hylis wrote:
bigboo, for the moment I do not think that these enviros will be continued.

the team works nevertheless, but I would not like that one still finds oneself in a situation which I find a little painful. With each stage one is prisoners of waitings. Still two weeks of that, of the players of the MT-forum showed Nadeo to have taken the money of United and to have barred themselves with. The incredible trick it is that the update Forever will have couté it even more than any play with Nadeo. Ca does not want to say that it is best for the player, but the evolutions of robustnesses (safety, optimization master server, protection, antitriche etc) take very a long time to make. In short, normally I does not react to the speculations, but I must say that it is not always pleasant. United was thought so that the players of enviros TMO, TM Power Up, TM, can continue to play with everyone, and vice and poured. These choices inevitably obvious at first sight, and are not always awaited, but they rather were done than to make another thing moreover “salesman” Vouala what, the video game, it is not necessarily formatted out of TM 2008 with tricks in more for satifaire the ignoramuses. And Ca does not want to say that I refuse that one is to judge, but I prefer that it is on the past, that future.

vouala 2
Florent

Hylis wrote:
this evolution is a large building site which has nothing to do with Forever. An engine, it is a techno and data which go together.

Lastly, jai impression that it is complicated to explain all that.

It would be well to stop distort them deductions. The more I try to explain, the more there is
and for angel rox, which has all followed, I announce that the update Forever is free
Uhm, ok

Hylis wrote:
I said that these enviros is abandoned. Ca does not want to say that one stops working, but that it was idiotic to work on these enviros. It was too “more of the same” I think that the players of TMN which want to remain in Stadium show in a certain manner that 7 enviros it is already much. and that one will not make move 4 years of work and reflexion like that. Other share, one saw players preferring TMO during years. etc

You would have preferred new enviros that United? I do not believe in it. To leave Sunrise, Original and Stadium with an aim of making the new one, it was for me a bad idea. It would be said that one is always at the same point.

Edict: I know that me does not express itself perfectly… but I prefer to rather make quantity than of the quantity for the blow, Ca will teach me :mrgreen:
Hmm, Florent against new envs? :S

Hylis wrote:
I wanted to say quantity rather than quality. And I hate you the_big_boo, you farmhouse put in disorder my thread

But a thing that I boards not included/understood, the mappeurs TMn will have access to the blocks stadium of TMu?
yes
Will they be also conditioned by the coopers like TMu?
does not include/understand
Will we see a reunification of TMX?
donot can answer
And then I to hope for graphic improvements on TMn?
that of United, yes

attention, one makes much for TrackMania Nations, but there will be also resctriction a little more severe to decrease the load master server and moderation. The functionality of TMU coutent much in network, and we must make optimizations permanent. We do not have the means of making turn 10 million players on the code of United. Already that Nations had roasted our waiter at its exit. This time, Ci, I still have the jitter, but if Ca occurs, Ca should be on a level even higher… And if the congestion arrives, one will débouteillera another thing to celebrate a so great number of player (before going to work on the waiters well on :mrgreen: )

Seems like TMNF will still be more restricted than TMUF in network features because they don't have the capacity to have all the TMN players run all the TMU features.
Hylis wrote:
as regards the waiter possibilities and speed of exchange of the data divided, Ca should be more hefty man indeed. What I listed concern rather of the small elements which “missed” in the system to make tools a little more coherent. As regards the audio, it is right which the cars which appear of a blow will arrive in a softer way at the noise level. It was right to illustrate the kind of small things which one makes, but there are tens of them (see hundreds) Most of the time, it is unperceivable, but Ca belonged to the large list
Ehh, ok, whatever

Hylis wrote:
Nazgul, we develop an engine of play like a system. On this subject, TM it is more than one million line of codes. This system deals with the elements present. The strategy of Nadeo is to be reactive. It is strange, but Ca goes rather well in my opinion. We looked at seeing whether it were possible to ask of the assistance to make enviros, and in spite of our efforts, that did not go. Such an amount of better a certain manner… Ca explains why it would be difficult for an investor to put million on the table and to require of an army of Dev. to make similar. TM, it is an adjustment, not a demolition. Therefore some prefer still deserted. Then of course, I could engage and train full people to make enviros and to sell them, but during this time I do not réfléchierais with the real innovations and I would endanger the major interest of the play. Only aujourd' today, I defined, while working with the people in the middle of the development, quatres choice which I think will have a reality for Forever. Same manner, I have not gone on a living room business only for three years, I think that it is to better work with limps. In short, one aims at the depth rather than the width. And when I look at TM Zap or matte the world cup, I think that our method has at least some advantages.

Good and as regards the questions about the URL and php, it would be although you answer, since it is of your fault. Rather than to have a computer graphics expert who makes blocks, there is a programmer who answers your questions :mrgreen:

skubidou, turns over in your limps. not but. the unification of the enviros, it was already work. Before you owed raler so today because one was going to give up the old men enviros etc Bref, you can still play on desert with full people, it because one it is brought until there, with the upward compatibility during years on 4 versions. I imagine that official times, the groups, the manialinks, regionalization, the advanced dedicated waiters do not interest you… but I really doubt that something interests you after such an amount of year. :evil:
More question replies i guess
Hylis wrote:
I think that you are free to put the blocks which you want. At the beginning I too was not for the result of the ground… and then I said myself perhaps that between pal, that adds interest. Therefore, rather than to address itself to only one type of player, one widens. It is like being against the lol maps, that has little direction. Its interaction with the ladder is another question.

for information, I think that the average lifespan of United between all the players is higher than 30 hours per player and it y forever have as many players at the same time. The every day ago more of the double of the record of Sunrise, and yet, the sales are still lower than that Ci. Then of course, one could make more, but one cannot do everything. But I have looked the industry of very near for 10 years and manner “player” for 25 years. And sometimes well the kind of waiting that one can hear make think of what entrainé the “traditional” play where it is today. The innovation is not finally any more with the model “more of the same” which started with the arrival of CD. No matter what the number of diskette, on Sword of Sodan already made spoken much about him, for a play with final, very poor. The video game has various forms. There is where the quantity of data has a direction, like Final Fantasy, and there is another where it is the program. To make both, it is better, but to make two things to the maximum, that does not have a direction… it would be like wanting to be champion of tennis shoe and football at the same time…
eh, about video games i guess?

Hylis wrote:
I am sorry Mister the franbéquois, but I must raise the joke: if TMNF is a chouilla different of TMN, you say that you will go on another play. I have a question: is what this new play will have exactly same the gameplay as TMN? :mrgreen:

Very of joke. I announce that you can make a ManiaLink page with the list of all waiters TMN maps only. Then, in only one clicks you can join them.

if one had followed this raisonement, one would ever have done all the free add ons. Then well on it is never perfect, but is not necessary to push mémé in the nettles, one makes already our better.
Heh, probably in reply to an "omg tmu sux tmn rulez" post

Also, waiter = server
To all the people asking specific questions:
Florent wrote: most of your questions should happen during the beta. You know, we already had one beat phase were players did not warned Nadeo about an important problem on their 'favorite' feature. Once it is released, it is too late, and before, it is too random. We have made work and I can not answer by yes or no all the time, sometimes it is 'maybe, please check during test phase'
About the new booster block:
Florent wrote: The purpose of this block is more complex than stupid. Let's say that it should enable some tracks to be played about different skill of players, with fun, but still be something precise for high skilled players. I think you better wait to use it before starting some harsh words on it. Once you have done, there will still be the possibilities to build tracks without it. If you fear is that too many tracks use it, it would be a small fear: this would mean that the block could be fun. I also would like to say that nothing is random in this block, it is quick cycles of one second. TrackMania is about precision, I know that ;)
About putting replays in your track with MT:
Florent wrote:Yes Crusard, the replay can come from any saved replay. You just press the 's' key, save your replay and use it when you want in the trigger. The start is given when you 'test' the track. But you may also probably "cut" a replay, but I am unsure.
Q: Will it be possible to respawn to checks in TMN?
Florent wrote:yes :mrgreen:

but probably have to be limited in competition for easiness to read the event
About Mediatracker clip trigger conditions:
Florent wrote:there are two conditions
time > or < ?
already trigger another clip ?
Zooz wrote:Google translation of a Florent post on the French forum:
There will be no system for authentication TMNF. Either you play with an account Nations, or you play with a United account. The authenfication is too hard. There are several reasons, such as the one that the players must feel that the support of Nations because they have authenticated their game, then you are a developer. Afterwards, at the grassroots level, there are many services like United (such as solo officials) that we can not provide any price.
About the upcoming public beta:
when will be released beta of TM Nations forever ?????
Florent wrote:next week or the week after
Also, this link was posted to a vid about Forever:


Well, is that enough info to make up for it? Note that these posts were made anywhere between Oct 2007 and now, so info might be outdated.

-------------------------
Also, if you really want to read random posts from the old thread, try Google's cache:

Search "site:www.tm-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=10793Trackmania Forever" and after that whatever you were looking for.

Most of the last 10 pages of old thread from said cache, in ugly plaintext format:
66
65
64
63
61
60
59
58
57

That enough? :pil

edit:
Also, please do not post leaked beta stuff in this thread! This is not allowed, and the testers are not allowed to show anything, and will be excluded for doing so. If you find leaked stuff, please send it to Blahitis or me so that we can try to figure out who leaked it.

Look what happened last time when someone posted leaked stuff, the thread disappeared, you wouldnt want that to happen again now would you? :mrgreen:
Also, you might get an official warning out of it if some moderator is in a bad mood, and 3 warnings = ban...

Flipper
highway camper
highway camper
Posts: 2
Joined: 23 Mar 2008 00:10
Owned TM-games: TMU, TMO, TMS

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by Flipper » 23 Mar 2008 00:12

gg Zooz :mrgreen: :1

User avatar
T.O.M.
smooth traffic navigator
smooth traffic navigator
Posts: 299
Joined: 15 Mar 2006 13:43
Owned TM-games: TMO,TMS,TMN,TMU
Manialink(s): T.O.M.
Location: Czech Republic

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by T.O.M. » 23 Mar 2008 00:20

yep sh*t happens sometimes.... but some cleanings dont harm... :wink:
MANIAPAGE : T.O.M.
ImageImage
sQs.TrackMania.cz
T.O.M.

Zooz
TM-Patrol
TM-Patrol
Posts: 5326
Joined: 13 Aug 2005 08:58
Owned TM-games: TMO, TMS, TMNF, TMUF
Manialink(s): zooz
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by Zooz » 23 Mar 2008 00:24

Blame the leakers :evil:

It was 80% spam anyway, i guess ^^
I'm putting the important posts in the first post here...

User avatar
BLaHiTiS
lord of the roads
lord of the roads
Posts: 3331
Joined: 12 Aug 2005 15:46
Owned TM-games: tmu tmo tms tmn
Manialink(s): muxitis
Location: Hasselt, Limburg, Belgium
Contact:

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by BLaHiTiS » 23 Mar 2008 00:33

hehe, and we cant possibly keep such incremental backups.. let's laugh over this instead of frown, the first post is back, and the only thing is bits and pieces that florent told about how the ladder cheating is going to be planned.

The features were very preliminary anyway.

Let's build this thread up again :P
Image

  • MB:Asus P8 H61
  • CPU:Intel i5 2400
  • RAM:8 Gb
  • GFX:Asus GTX-580 (1500mb DDR5) - Forceware 75.33
  • DirectX: June 2011
  • SND:Realtek HD on mobo
  • OS:Windows 7 SP1- Home Premium
[/size]

Cyrlaur
Pit Crew
Pit Crew
Posts: 889
Joined: 12 Aug 2005 14:49
Owned TM-games: TMO, TMS, TMU
Manialink(s): Cyrlaur
Location: France
Contact:

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by Cyrlaur » 23 Mar 2008 00:42

just ... :lol:

That's radical moderation :mrgreen: :1010

tcq
speedy pilot
speedy pilot
Posts: 380
Joined: 05 Apr 2007 08:09
Location: Germany

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by tcq » 23 Mar 2008 00:45

loool ;) nice work zooz :p :1010

BLiNNeMaNS
tricycle manager
tricycle manager
Posts: 26
Joined: 26 May 2006 00:52
Owned TM-games: TMN-F, TMU-F
Location: Netherlands

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by BLiNNeMaNS » 23 Mar 2008 01:35

Zooz, could you please moderate all other topics as well? So i don't have to scroll that much anymore.
(poep gebeurt)

Anyways, some curiousity on my behalf:
Will there be backwards compatibility to tmn and tmu(carmodels/Mediatracker)?
(as i only heard rumours and "probably, 'cause it used to be this way on all other versions(MT))

Zooz
TM-Patrol
TM-Patrol
Posts: 5326
Joined: 13 Aug 2005 08:58
Owned TM-games: TMO, TMS, TMNF, TMUF
Manialink(s): zooz
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by Zooz » 23 Mar 2008 07:58

Probably, it is a patch, that normally doesn't break backwards compatibility... That would suck, wouldn't it?

User avatar
s!em
speedy pilot
speedy pilot
Posts: 573
Joined: 06 Dec 2005 12:53
Owned TM-games: ALL
Location: Belgium

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by s!em » 23 Mar 2008 09:11

Well, maybe that delete was a good thing:
now newbies not gonna ask stupid question cause all the info is on the first post ^^

User avatar
Domi
speedy pilot
speedy pilot
Posts: 556
Joined: 23 Jan 2007 20:32
Owned TM-games: TMNF,TMUF
Location: Zagreb.Croatia

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by Domi » 23 Mar 2008 09:12

but we're almost already on the second page xD
Image

Dec
solid chaser
solid chaser
Posts: 971
Joined: 20 May 2006 12:22
Owned TM-games: TMO, TMS, TMNF, TMUF
Location: SLOVENIA, Radeče
Contact:

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by Dec » 23 Mar 2008 09:26

Yea we can spam it again ^^

Anyways, **** happens zooz, the hour was late, you have an excuse because of that ^^

User avatar
BLaHiTiS
lord of the roads
lord of the roads
Posts: 3331
Joined: 12 Aug 2005 15:46
Owned TM-games: tmu tmo tms tmn
Manialink(s): muxitis
Location: Hasselt, Limburg, Belgium
Contact:

Re: Where is the Forever thread?

Post by BLaHiTiS » 23 Mar 2008 09:44

an undo feature in the database would probably make it double the size also, if you see the way searches are indexed and all words of each posts are already stored in another section of the database as well,

what would happen if you'd delete a thread and it has to do it to an undo buffer ? if it's very big you're waiting like an eternity for this, so everything must be stored as duplicate for instant acces I thought.
Image

  • MB:Asus P8 H61
  • CPU:Intel i5 2400
  • RAM:8 Gb
  • GFX:Asus GTX-580 (1500mb DDR5) - Forceware 75.33
  • DirectX: June 2011
  • SND:Realtek HD on mobo
  • OS:Windows 7 SP1- Home Premium
[/size]

User avatar
Leak
speedy pilot
speedy pilot
Posts: 497
Joined: 13 Aug 2005 10:01
Owned TM-games: TMO, TMS, TMU
Location: Linz, Austria
Contact:

Re: TRACKMANIA FOREVER

Post by Leak » 23 Mar 2008 14:03

Zooz wrote:Well, I was linked to a post of some leaked pics in the thread, and it was the newest post, but it got linked in such a way that it only displayed one post, so I thought it was a new thread, and hit the delete thread button. Whoops :oops:
It's all fun and games until someone loses a thread... :mrgreen:

np: Autechre - WNSN (Quaristice)
"I'm not anti-anything, I'm anti-everything, it fits better." - Sole

Intel Core 2 Quad Q9450, 2x ATI Radeon 4850 512MB, Creative Soundbastler X-Fi Platinum, 2GB RAM, XBox 360 Controller

User avatar
driftguy
sunday driver
sunday driver
Posts: 73
Joined: 28 Feb 2008 21:30
Owned TM-games: TMO TMNF TMUF X2
Location: Norway
Contact:

Re: TRACKMANIA FOREVER

Post by driftguy » 23 Mar 2008 14:52

good jobb zooz
Its not to play its how to win the game :P

Image
Image

Post Reply